tv The Last Word With Lawrence O Donnell MSNBC August 18, 2018 5:00pm-6:00pm PDT
tomorrow, will be 8-1918. thank you. 81818 and sunday, 81918. math and symmetry may not be your thing. in a world that could use balance, i will take it happy 817181. now, for the other big interview, i turn to my colleague. >> one point with brennan, i thought was entering, he seemed to want to convey to you and everyone watching, he doesn't view what he is saying is politics or partisan. he is giving analysis. this retaliation that you are documenting, is designed to make people look at him that way.
>> yes. when i pressed him specifically on the use of the term, nothing short of treasonous. with regard to helsinki, he didn't back down from that, it got his irish up. he defended it not just his right to say t the basis for saying that, and made strong remarks down that line. throughout the interview. this was john brennan, unbowed, and telling everyone what he thinks we need to know what about is going on. it was fascinating, glad to watch it thank you so much. good luck tonight. >> tonight, donald trump faces mounting legal and political pressure, a federal jury will take this weekend off, before determining the fate of his campaign manager. and recommending jail time for
george popodopolous. and over who could win the mid terms. republican leaders are mobilizing now. take the new video. aiming to ril up conservative turn out this. is now a war for the trump presidency. it comes from a new multimillion dollar steve bannon, helping congressional republicans, whether they want his help or not. bannon is one of the most controversial figures in u.s. politics for many reasons t can be hard to see what is happening in the mid terms without seeing what he is up to. people can't decide what to do about dwremts in the politics, if what is happening is not exposed, not knownor not
confronted. bannon has played a role in politics, he never goes on tv, never taken questions on air. that we are about to interview my new interview with bannon, advar sarial reaction, and fact checking from political analysts here with me live. this interview had no ground rules, nothing off limits, we talked about the project for the mid terms, his donors, policy record, from roy moore to char lotsville. his view of james comey's firing, and why he is a witness to collusion and obstruction investigation going on right now. bannon recalls the first time they ever spoke to the door way of donald trump's oval office. starting with the mid terms. >> starting with the mid terms,
if they were held today, who do you think would win the house? >> if they were held today, we would have a tough time holding the house. do i. north of 25, 30 seats maybe north of that people projecting 45 or 50 seats, i by november 6th, we will win this. i think all this takes is people on our side of the football focus og what has to happen. up or down vote on president trump. it will come as a rech rendum on him. the entire political culture, those who are around him. telling him, it is okay to lose the house. work on the democrats, if you can run against a democratic house in 2020, it is bad advice. we have a i made a film that is focused on getting out the trump base, the deplorables and the blue color democrats, the i think they did get a do over to 2016, i think this is the first
re-elect. >> you said you are going to save the trump presidency in the mid terms, does he know he needs you to save him? >> i don't think that was the quote, the message is about president trump, to me, an up or down vote other the grass roots democrats are running as an impeachment campaign. our side has to understand that. you can't run on tax cuts, you have to run on the package. >> impeach mtd is on the ballot in november, why? >> they put it on the ballot, so has nancy pelosi. when they say they are not talking about impeachment. they understand, with we put impeachment on the ballot t is the way to get the deplorables out. you have to come out to support president trump. people on the democratic left,
you saw it there are people in these districts in july, in 90 degree heat going door to door. they are talking about the impeachment of president trump. all we are saying, it is already on the ballot. let's do it. >> the new group, citizens of the american republican. you say we are at war. >> the trump says film at war. trump is as war against the political class. >> it is my film. "trump at war." showing that trump is at war with the class, the opposition party media, and basically, he is at economic war with china. when you look at this film, you see that president trump is a disruptor and innoivator, he is delivering- the promises he put forward to the american people. that he is not into just managing the decline of the country, he will try to turn it around. that is what the film is. it is a film focused on getting
our base jacked up and out. if we don't get the base out on november 6th, we will have a a bad day at the polls, the invisible trump voter. >> what do you say to republicans who say, why take your help if you haven't backed winning candidates in the special elecs thus far? >> i think i did in the primary. the republican establishment. roy moore would have won that election, if mcmccolon and others didn't turn against him. a good feel how to turn people out. >> i have been involved in this, since the tea party, lection in 2010. we have a very good idea how to make the films, you bring up -- how can you blame republicans for what happened in alabama? >> came out on sunday morning, i am not voting, i am doing a
write-n mcconnell was the guy. the republican establishment that dumped it to the post, when their candidate got smoked in the primary. we are not only going to support moore, they were meeting to unseat moore, and not to seat him if he won. that was the republican establishment turning against him. they would rather lose control of the senate to allow disrupters in there. >> hou much money does your group have? >> quite a bit. we made an impressive film. i have a 25-person staff. we run a war room. >> over $5 million? >> yes. >> over 10 million? >> i don't want to put a number on it. >> between five million and 10 million? >> enough resources and more resources pouring in from donors and start a door program i never
had a problem getting resources. >> are you very rich, you know a lot of rich people. >> i have had a good run. i know high net worth individuals. >> who is funding this? >> private donors like in the democratic party, and groups. private donors. >> why not tell people who they are? >> it is the law, they have a right to do that. >> public or private. >> if they want to come forward, they k. >> does it include wall street, finance people, hedge fund? >> hedge fund people, yes. >> i think you would say, we are very much focused on we are the hawk consider-4. i am up-front with the situation with china, i tend to think that there are people who back this that are china hawks. >> for you, ideology, for them, they want to make money because of their positions in china.
>> because of their patriotism. >> do they have an advancement outcome in terms of positions to benefit from this? >> no. >> it is more about what they think the direction of the country s. >> is there anyone you would not take money from? >> not from foreigners, there are certain people. i am selective about who i take money from. i have had good partners, pretty happy. i am selective about who i take money from. i have never had a problem raising money, particularly, in wall street and others, you see people who come from blue collar backgrounds that like this economic nationalism. they like the trump program, they are supportive. >> your critics say you talk smack about wall street, then are you funded by wall street. >> not funded by wall sfreet. >> you just told me it including financiers and those in a position with china? >> those who understand our
position. the people that understand, i didn't say they had a position in china. >> how do you take on wall streetd if you are funded by wall street? >> >> i came out of wall street. goldman sandwiches, because you made money on wall street or currently in a hedge fund, some of, i rng it has been a great way for some people who are blue collar backgrounds to get ahead. >> main piece of economic legislation that has been passed in the trump administration is the tax bill. most of those benefits go to the wealthy, is that a mistake? >> the tax bill was the corporate tax bill to make sure we were competitive with germany and china. if you look at manufacturing jobs coming back here, part and paricle of the situation with the tar rives, the economic
package and the tax package, was a part of it. >> are you talking about. >> the tax policies. 83% of the benefits. >> not globally. >> not globally, i am talking about what happened here. what happened here in manufacturing jobs coming back, that is where you got economic growth in the country. one of the reasons is the tax bill. >> i didn't actually love some of the things on the first income tax. >> that is what i am talking about. wall street journal reported in the oval office, i fought for a tax for people making 45 million. i lost that fight. not that it can't be draet addresses in the future. >> when you see 83% going to the top 1%. is that too much. >> corporate america is becoming more competitive. i think it is about manufacturing jobs, and if you look at president trump's overall economic agenda, it is
working for middle class, working class people. >> you talk about pop limp. the president went to marlago, and said you all just got a lot richer, is that your popularism? >> i think popularism, about president trump is about his program. this tax cut was about repatriation of cash, to make the manufacturing side stronger. right off capital expenditure, and period zero. it was about rebuilding the base. that is what i am talking about. am i excited about every aspect of the tax bill? not that excited. i was a big supporter of paul ryan's adjustable tax, it didn't go anywhere. >> it went to plan b. there is a strong tax bill. >> that is the beginning of the tax bill.
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misconduct. decisions that helped to fuel a back lash, a record breaking number of female candidates running this year. democrats running against trump. the growing movements like me too, and time's up. i asked bannon about time's up. and rising opposition of trump among women. and whether it is a chance to force changeos what he refers to as the patriarchy. >> what is time's up means to you? >> the end of the patriarchy, what they want to do. a fundamental shift in the power dynamic in society. time's up movement. the resistance, and tom stiers impeach the president. the enthusiasm. >> time is up. you say, challenge the patriarchy, given gender rilayings in this country and around the world.
isn't that a good thing to revise the patriarchy as you put it? >> my oldest daughter is a west point granddaughter that served with the 101st airborne, sitting in her uniform on the thrown the saddam hussein. my daughters are living proof that i am a huge believer in that. the time's up movement, some of the things, sexual haermt, in the media company, not vetted with the executives is something that needs to be done. i am not 100% with the times up movement. i can see it is a powerful force, i was the one who said, oprah winfree will coy will wilt of that. >> are you saying it say good thing? >> it is constructive to review
things like this. radical movement is not a positive thing. it is good to question your assumptions, particularly, what we found out in some companies that things went on, i think it is quite positive. >> the way you talk about your daughter, and gender relations is very different from the way donald trump talks, a gender gap that is now 20 points in negative views of the president. let me finish. is this party walking away from women voters or college educated women voters? >> we won white woman over hillary clinton. working class women, 70-30. donald trump does resonate with that. >> respond, i will give you more time. >> the gender gap in 2016, at 11 points, the largest in 20 years. >> go ahead. >> i think a lot of that was
minority women. donald trump. 8% of overall african american voters, a big turn-out in african american women. >> is donald trump walking away from women voters? >> no. i think ivanka has been engaged in women's issues, she is talking about job training and i think she is engaged. you see donald trump has a terrific relationship with his daughter and wife, shows what he thinks about this. a lot of thing that is people jump on the tweets, jumped on some of the things that allegedly happened during the campaign. women who came out to try to stop it as we pushed through that billy bush weekend, everybody said he should resign. people walked away from the campaign. he presented the facts of the locker room talk. and we went to st. louis the next night. i brought the people that bill
clinton actually molested. i think that the merge people weighed and measured that. >> you brought adult women accusers of bill clinton and say they should be heard. the accusers of donald trump, should they be heard? he is facing suits from them. and roy moore, faced his own accusers, including multiple women -- you brought it up. >> what about those accusers. >> if they want to come forward, come forward. some of them were coming forward in the court system now. they are not shy about going after donald trump. he has not abandoned women at all. if you look at the question, i think it will play well. >> youbling up the accusers,
what do you say to people who see your backing of roy moore, accused of legally worse things. >> i will finish the question. >> that was -- hang on. >> i will finish the question, i will give you response time. >> yes, sir. >> what do you say to people who say to you, is the only standard here partisanship, if you are not giving roy moore's accusers more time? >> they will have additional time. came forward. the biggest flat forts, roy moore was buried by that. you can't, they had the biggest media platforms in the country. the questions gets to be, how legitimate were those? did they turn out to be something? >> did it shake your view? >> absolutely not. >> we looked at the allegations, i don't believe them then, i don't believe them today.
as they get adjudicated. maybe i will change my mind. what i saw then and now. absolutely not. >> bottom line, are you saying, what was a historical gap is 20 with trump and women, you think it will close? >> yes. do we get it to 11, i don't know. i think 20. more importantly, in those districts, you have to hold the house, no doubt about that. >> important set of questions, we will go next to the first reaction from the panel about steve bannon, what you heard. and later, steve bannon, how he heard about the firing of james comey, and the first thing they said about the white house. many people living with diabetes
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>> we turn to our panelists, and former republican strategist, the sister for american policy, and jason jon son, we are about to hear the battle rebuttals to steve bannon. here are briefly, the aggressive claims he made about the approach to the mid terms. >> i think that democrats, the grass roots democrats are running as an impeachment campaign. our side has to understanding that. you can't run on tax cuts. i fought for a 44% tax for people making over $5 million, i lost that fight. >> is donald trump walking the gop away from the women voters? >> definitely not. i am not with the time's up movement. i see it is a powerful force.
i think they did get a do over to 2016. this is the first re-elect. trump is at war with the opposition party media, and basically, at economic war with china. >> i think this interview demonstrates that bannon is and always has been basically a scharr loton. it is hard to know where to begin. first, on the tax cuts. donald trump and steve bannon acted as if they were champions of the working class. with this tax cut and this economy, wages for working class people of all kinds, even white have stayed stagnant or fallen behind. 81% is going to the top 1%. wages are falling behind, even with the trade war, the idea
that president is of the working class is a joke. let me say on the issue of times up. i may agree with him in the power of the time's up movement. frankly, the idea that you can talk about the time's up movement in any positive term and support donald trump, accused of 16 women. and it demonstrates, he is just not a charlotton, out of the main stream that should be considered reasonable in american policy. >> he is a white nationalist and terrorist sympathizer. he isn't a believer in american democracy, he is a believer in alex andier did you gachblt thee are not things he believes in, he performs on television to
make people realize he is a terrorist sympathizer. the core of what he is saying is nonsense. me too, i believe in the patriarchy. he sounds like a pimp, saying i got a great plan to pay your college tuition. you can't support donald trump and support women. you can't say you support democracy, and dismiss the fact that you got 3% of african american women to vote for you. you can't take all of your money from wall street and deny it you can't say, i won't take foreign funds and crisscross europe, the uk, and italy, getting support from other he is a scharrlotton, and a danger to the american public.
>> as a business proposition, is that if the election were tomorrow, you could see losses in the republican house, of 25, as high as 45 seats. what he is going out there and fleecing donors, if you give me money, i can arrest this trend. make this race something other than a referendum about donald trump that is not going to happen. i expect to raise money over it. what is true about the tax cut t added a trillion dollars to the national debt. it did nothing to lift wages of income for working people in this country, and lastly, the idea that there is a resurgeance because of the tax cut of manufacturing jobs flooding back
into the country is preposterous and nonsensical. and lastly, let me say, the idea that he said with a straight face with conviction, that we should be at economic war with china. that his working policy, advocacy for the tar rives against a country that holds trillions of our debt and paper in an integrated global economy, is crack pottery. it is terrible for the american consumer. worse for the merge working person, it is completely outside of the economic and political main stream. it will do a lot of damage over the next year to a lot of people, including in the places where trump won. in no no small issue, in places like fayette county, iowa, soybean farmers lose their markets because of this inept
policy. >> i agree with what steve is saying about the people who are going to be hurt by his policies. the reality is, that donald trump claimed to speak for a number of people who were struggling in the economy. those people are struggling, if not the same, much more, farmers hurt by trade, people in factories, hurt by trade policies, as well as overall. the tax cut, was a giant bait and switch. the kind of giant bait and switch that donald trump's rhetoric would have, and the bottom line of companies, and hurt working people. which is the kind of rhetoric that bannon used to attack during the swap. that is why bannon demstreets, this is a fraud to raise money. >> is there an avenue here for the people who oppose bannon to make the argument that you can
expose that all of the things around the middle class don't seem to get done. he said he didn't get the infrastructure bill, he didn't get the break up of the banks, he is made it didn't happen. the tax cuts did happen. >> he doesn't have a record of accomplishment. neither does his president that is why the you have a guy, he is the guy who won one super bowl five years ago, still playing off it you got donald trump in office, run against one of the least popular democrats in history. he doesn't have the rhetorical skills to justify the economic policies that consistently failed people. he wants to pretend he can pretend they will follow him through the pit. campaign policy, past 2016. >> the panel stays with me. we will get into real revelations, steve bannon talks
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mueller inside the trump white house. days before mueller was named special council. as he was heading into the oval office, to meet about the embaited fab. that was the last time they spoke face to face. the here are the key russia highlights. >> when i basically laid out the facts about what the comey situation is was, if people decide to go in a different direction that is not my thing. i am not there to fight to the very end. >> you advise against it. walk us through the day he was fired. >> i am sitting in the chief of staff office, working for something for rice that needs said to be done. i saw it. >> i thought it was a big mistake, i thought it would lead to a special council.
everything i said, it would lead to special council. it would have take know a couple of months and wrapped up. >> when is the first time during your white house service that you talked to bob mueller? >> well, bob mueller came in, in gave advice or was interviewed, as publicly reported for fbi director. bob mueller, i was sitting in the outer office, and mueller walks up to me. i was standing in front of hope at her computer terminal. he shook hands, steve, i can't believe that mueller is a marine. i can't believe someone in the senior naval service to matriculate at west point. i said, he is a thorough guy to know that. >> what was he trying to say to you? >> i think he was trying to introduce himself. at that time, he was there to
give advice on the type of person to select to be fbi director. >> so, this is fascinating, are you there, working in the white house. after comey is fired. bob mueller walks n says this to you, and goes into the oval? >> yes. >> you say are you a witness of fact. a good thing for you. >> i think so. >> you haven't been advised you are something worse in their eyes, where you a witness to obstruction or collusion or both? >> i think i am a witness of fact for all of it they don't, they go through the whole thing. i have been to capitol hill, i have a witness of fact there also. >> the meet with the russians was treasonous, paul manafort. >> i don't think it just, people from other countries, russians, whatever, come in and try to get
opposition research. there is enough, you had to get down there, and as we did, when i took over the campaign on that monday. coe with kelly-anne, the first monday we took over, we put out a statement from then candidate trump, about paul manafort, we referenced clinton cash. >> by your standard, it is that knowledge of the foreign offer of help? >> well, foreign offer of help, trying to do something like that. >> if donald trump knew about that he was in on treasonous behavior in your standard? >> no. if it hasn't been proven he knows anything about it. he denied knowing. >> you said there sia zero chance he didn't tell him. >> take michael cohen for michael cohen, right? you active to take -- you don't
know what michael cohen's doing with federal authorities what deals he's cutting, what he's trying to do -- >> if a candidate knows about that in advance, are they part of treasonous behavior by your standard? >> i think you have to call into question, if somebody's actually out there trying to get information from foreign parties, you have to question that. >> if mueller could prove that about donald trump, that would concern you? >> it would definitely concern me, yes. the president's been pretty adamant he didn't know about it, hasn't known about it. when we come back, we get into charlottesville and more from our live panel tonight. taking the stress out of pickups. and we're putting safety at the heart of everything we do. with a single tap, we're giving you new ways to let loved ones know you're on your way. uber has new leadership, a new vision and is moving in a new direction... forward.
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there is perhaps no controversy that has dogged president trump and steve bannon more than their both sides response to the violence and killing of a counter protester heather heyer in charlottesville at a white supremacy unite the right rally just over a year ago. the incident came a week before bannon was leaving the white house. trump's response ignited more pain and revulsion on the issues of racism and civil rights. i asked steve bannon about the issue today. >> charlottesville. >> yep. >> was the president wrong to say there was blame on both sides? >> no. listen. he's absolutely correct. the whole discussion, what the president was saying, go back and look at those statements he made. if you look at it, what he's saying is that the discussion about the confederate monuments, whether the confederate monuments should be covered, whether they should be removed,
whether the confederate monuments of these generals are part of southern heritage, there are people on both sides. that's a first amendment right to debate that and march on that and protest on that. that's what he was trying to say. >> let's look at what -- >> hang on. if you talk about the neo-nazis and the neo-confederates and the kkk and anti-fa, i think the president has beened ed ed eda saying both those parties are wrong, both parties shouldn't be allowed to come there and start to cause havoc. >> this is what the president said. let's go to the words. quote, i think there is blame on both sides. you had a group on one side that was bad and you had a group on the other side that was also very violent. nobody wants to say it. but i will say it right now. it was the organizers of the rally that talked about anti-black prejudice, that chanted anti-semitic slogans and there is a second-degree murder charge for heather heyer's death right now.
>> he's been absolutely adamant about this. that's what i'm saying. when you talk about the confederate monuments, whether they should stay or not or be covered or not, the president is saying there is good people on both sides. okay? when you talk about the people that come there for violence, he's condemned those people. he condemned the neo-confederates. he condemned the neo-nazis and the kkk. he also condemned antifa. if you look at "cuomo" the other night, the problem with the left and the problem with the mainstream media, you're giving them a complete free pass. they are just as violent. they are just as violent as these kkk guys and they have to be condemned. that's where the violence has come from. i have actually advocated even a situation like charlottesville. to me they shouldn't have the right to march because they come looking for a fight. they come to do violence. what you are seeing is not just a tremendous cost, but you are also seeing violence. i think the president, i think his word is being smeared. i don't think he could be more adamant about that. look at the march that happened the other day. nine guys showed up. the mainstream media -- >> let's finish charlottesville.
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panel. steve schmidt, amir tannen, jason johnson. we've been watching many parts of this interview with steve bannon, most recently his defense on charlottesville. >> i think his statements are reprehensib reprehensible. one person died in charlottesville, heather heyer. the president never really talked about her, never discussed her. steve bannon still trying to equate antefa with the people who came in, announced the whole thing, announced over and over statements like "jews will not replace us," racist, virulently anti-semitic advice. still steve bannon, advisor to the president, probably fueled his racist remarks at the time, i believe it is racist to equate these groups. has the ear of the president. i will also make a side note which is, on the mueller
investigation, donald trump -- sorry, steve bannon said at the time that there's no way donald trump didn't tell -- donald trump jr. didn't tell donald trump, his dad, about that meeting. now when he's trying to raise money from millions of people to support donald trump, he's basically saying, oh, yeah, no, donald trump never did that, or i don't know that that happened, or he denied it. we should take his statements at the time, not his statements today. >> all this week we've been having these conversations whether or not omarosa should get this kind of air time, right? i think this thing with steve bannon -- this is a reminder of where that discussion should go. this man is a terrorist sympathizer. he's trying to spin it to an american audience. he is the father of the alt-right. the alt-right are white nationalists. you can't accomplish white nationalism without violence. and what happened in charlottesville was a protest march that turned into a terrorist attack. and he's going to try and spin that to the best of his ability. you can say, ante fa -- that's like saying batman and the joker
are the same. anti-fa exists to be anti-fascist and he is a supporter of fascists. no matter how many times he tries to sprinkles on the turd, we know what it is, we know how it smells, we know how dangerous it is. any man like this who wants to be a part of american mainstream politics is a danger and he should be called as such. >> steve, your reaction to any and all of the above? >> he's verbally dexterous enough to do what he did, legitimize these neo-nazi groups to place them into the mainstream of american politics. well, these people are radical, but there's radical people on the other side, and he sets up this equivalence argument. here's the reality. is that in august of 2017, neo-nazis carrying torches, straight out of the s.a. in
1935, marched on charlottesville, virginia, chanting "jews will not replace us." there are no good nazis. the only good nazi, we understood this by the end of world war ii, is a dead nazi. the nazi movement venerates the most evil leader of the most evil regime in all of human history that committed its greatest crime. these white nationalists, these racists, these klans men, they have gotten the wink, they've gotten the nod, they have been emboldened under this vile and racist administration. and that's ground truth. so you can see all the verbal gymnastics. you can see all the equivalence that steve bannon lays down. but here in 2018, white nationalists, racists, have been emboldened, they've been emboldened by this president. and lastly, i heard steve bannon what i think the news of the interview is, is basically
acknowledge that if donald trump, in fact, knew the purpose of the meeting was to get information from the russians about hillary clinton, which he most certainly knew, because steve bannon was telling the truth when he said that there is no way that donald trump jr. took the meeting, had the meeting, and didn't report back to daddy. >> well, he did say that, and steve ---ing wh building on tha he did concede that would be very concerning. that is the exact thing mueller is probing that michael cohen will reportedly testify to, and that nira and i pointed out. steve bannon already implied he believed donald trump was in on seeking that foreign help. >> right. so what i heard steve bannon say today is that when we all find out that that is, in fact, exactly what happened, that in his estimation the president committed treason. that's the news of this interview tonight. >> i agree. i think the reality here is that
steve bannon said at the time and he says today, dealing with the russians was treasonous. was trait russ, treasonous. he knows donald trump jr. told his dad. we all know he told him. the infamous call placed. it's just reality. and i think that is the fact that he's going to have to concede that, and i hope he's already conceded it to mueller. >> you make that point, he would not tell me the number of days but he had a voluminous, he said, detailed meeting with mueller, and he is it appears smart enough to know not to lie about that. as you say, he may have already laid the predicate for that. jason johnson gets our final comment. >> i am glad that you got the opportunity to speak to him. i think it's important that we know how dangerous he is. but i don't want to ever hear from this man again. we have a history in this country of terrorism. the klan is a terrorist organization. we are in danger. they kill people. this isn't nice, this isn't simple. i hope steve bannon, this is his last view interview and he fails in everything he tries to do from now on politically. >> i really appreciate the
vigor, the rigor, and the seriousness of what are seer yous topics from each of you. my special thanks to jason johnson, steve schmidt as well. if you want to see the entire interview with steve bannon, it will be posted later tonight on msnbc.com. people can make up their own minds. i turn it now over to "the 11th hour with brian williams." john brennan says trump is drunk on power after the president revokes his security clearance. this as "the washington post" reports the white house is already drafting more cancelations. plus steve bannon tells msnbc november will be an up or down vote on trump. we sat down with ari melber and he's standing by with details. the paul manafort jury asks to be let out early without a verdict. after nearly 15 hours of deliberations they will be back